How to Deal with Separation Anxiety in Relationships with Megan McCullough

Episode Summary of “How to Deal with Separation Anxiety in Relationships”

Welcome back to The Communicate & Connect Podcast, where we explore the intricate dynamics of relationships and mental well-being, especially within military families. I’m your host, Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky, and today we delve into Episode 54: “How to Deal with Separation Anxiety in Relationships.” Joining us is Megan McCullough, a licensed clinical social worker and military spouse with 19 years of experience navigating the unique challenges of military life.

In this episode, we’ll uncover the often unspoken struggles faced by military spouses, who are expected to “suck it up” and push forward amidst frequent and abrupt separations. Megan shares her invaluable personal insights into the cultural and emotional hurdles, emphasizing the importance of validating these experiences and promoting open discussion. Together, we’ll discuss the normalization of seeking therapy, the crucial role of communication, and finding effective coping mechanisms like grounding techniques and self-soothing.

This conversation sheds light on the messy realities of deployment and reintegration, from dealing with internal stigma to maintaining connections within dual-income households. Whether you’re part of a military family or looking to understand more about separation anxiety, this episode offers practical advice and heartfelt encouragement. So, tune in as we navigate through the complexities of separation anxiety and strengthen our ability to communicate and connect.

Don’t forget to check out our ARE quiz based using the brief accessibility, responsiveness, and engagement scale for further insights into your relationship. Let’s get started!

Guest Speaker Bio – Megan McCullough

Megan McCullough a Licensed Clinical Social Worker in South Carolina and Maryland and specializes in working with anxiety and trauma. She has a deep understanding of the military lifestyle as an Army brat, a Veteran combat arms Army officer, and an 19-year military spouse. She have lived and traveled extensively across the world and is a Southern transplant from the Pacific Northwest. You can learn more about her and her services at https://www.meganmccullough.care/.

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Episode Transcript for “How to Deal with Separation Anxiety in Relationships”

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:00:01]:
This podcast is sponsored by Communicate and Connect Counseling, where we have a team of therapists who provide individual, couples, and family therapy services, all tailored to meet the needs of military and veteran families. To learn more about our services, visit www.communicateandconnect.com.

Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Communicate and Connect Podcast. You’re listening to episode 54, which is part of our attachment theory series. And today we’re talking on how to deal with separation anxiety in relationships with Megan McCullough. Megan, I’m so glad you’re here. Separation anxiety is something that I’m excited that we’re talking about.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:01:01]:
I’ll tell you right now, my husband is gone, and I’m feeling the separation anxiety. So it’s, like, good timing for this episode. But thank you so much for being here. Maybe you could just tell us a little bit about you and your background as we get started.

Megan McCullough [00:01:22]:
Yeah, sure. I’m super excited to be here today. My name is Megan McCullough. I am a licensed clinical social worker. I practice in South Carolina in person, and I also practice virtually in Maryland. I’m also a military spouse of 19 years, have been through multiple deployments, geo batching schools, TD wise. So I really understand firsthand what it’s like to be separated.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:01:52]:
Yeah, you’ve done it all, is what I’m doing.

Megan McCullough [00:01:55]:
Oh, yes. So you share that, your husband. Yeah. So you telling me when your husband’s gone, you know, that really resonates that feeling. I can really respect that.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:02:05]:
Yes.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:02:07]:
Thank you. Yeah, I think what I’m really loving right now is that you can talk to us both as a therapist, but as a military spouse who’s gone through it and who’s gone through it so often. 19 years.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:02:27]:
Yeah.

What is separation anxiety in relationships?

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:02:28]:
So maybe. Maybe we could just talk a little bit first about, like, what is separation anxiety? I guess it sounds really straightforward. It’s like I’m separate, feel anxious.

Megan McCullough [00:02:44]:
Yeah. So I would really look at separation anxiety as difficult emotions that arise when really one of your primary attachment figures is gone. Right. And when we’re talking about a military context, we know that the spouses are gone quite often, and it’s quite often just, you know, there’s not a lot of notice.

We don’t really know when it’s going to happen. And so there is actually a nervous system response when that person that you connect with is not around. And it creates a lot of feelings of, it could be instability, insecurity, could be nervousness, maybe some fear, but a lot of really uncomfortable emotions that are coming up when that person isn’t there?

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:03:36]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:03:36]:
I like what you’re sharing because I guess we label it separation anxiety, but it could be a lot of different types of emotions happening.

Megan McCullough [00:03:46]:
Right, right. And I think that may manifest, you know, differently with every person, maybe based on their own experiences. Right. And what they’ve been through in their own life.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:03:57]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:03:58]:
That makes a lot of sense.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:04:01]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:04:01]:
I was thinking when you said we often don’t have a lot of heads up notice my husband hasn’t been gone very long, just a couple of days. But he told me how. He was like, oh, I told you I’m leaving. Right. I was like, no, you didn’t.

Megan McCullough [00:04:19]:
And those first couple days, I think, are often the worst because it’s still so fresh and you’re still really in this stage of kind of this liminal state of how to be when this person is gone and you have to adjust to this new reality that you’re in.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:04:36]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:04:37]:
Thankfully, this one, he’s not gone very long, but it is adjustment. That word really stands out to me. It’s like reworking my whole life in a way of when he’s not here.

Megan McCullough [00:04:55]:
Right.

Separation anxiety in relationships is normal

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:04:56]:
So I’m thinking it seems just really normal to me that we would all have really difficult feelings when our partners are gone.

Megan McCullough [00:05:07]:
Yeah, it’s very normal. And there’s something that I’ve noticed that’s so interesting in the military that I think a lot of spouses listening will resonate with this is there’s almost sometimes this comparison, right, that we’ve seen of, well, your husband’s only gone for four months, so that’s really okay. And mine’s gone for 18. And if we’re looking at, you know, attachment theory, it doesn’t really matter how long they’re gone. You’re still going to feel the same because they’re still not there.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:05:34]:
Yes.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:05:35]:
Oh, I like that. I hope anybody listening is really taking that in, that you could have those feelings regardless of how long they’re going to be gone.

Megan McCullough [00:05:44]:
Absolutely. Hundred percent. I hope someone, you know, maybe might hear that because, you know, it can be tough in the community sometimes. Not everyone’s supportive of each other.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:05:54]:
Yes. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:05:57]:
Which is unfortunate. I’m also thinking about, I know for me, I can be kind of like, I’ll maybe do that to myself. Maybe someone isn’t saying that to me, but I’ll be like, oh, this is a short one. Like, why am I having so many emotions about it? I think that’s really great. Even if somebody is in a supportive spouse community, they might be thinking, well, I’ve done this ten times, or this is a short one.

And I’m thinking, what’s wrong with me that I keep having these emotions? I like that we’re sort of saying it’s really normal and it’s normal anytime you’re separated. And of course you would be having those emotions, and it doesn’t. Maybe we should be having those emotions from an attachment perspective, that there’s nothing wrong.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:07:01]:
I don’t have bad coping skills or something if I am struggling.

Attachment theory and separation anxiety in relationships

Megan McCullough [00:07:06]:
Right. Absolutely. And I think we can discuss a little bit more about maybe what that looks like with attachment. Or some people might have a more difficult time. Right. If they’ve had previous negative experience, maybe with attachment, maybe their primary parents really weren’t someone they could connect with. And so there’s an attachment rupture early in life. And so that could be something that could really be difficult for a spouse, could make it even more difficult going through a deployment.

Megan McCullough [00:07:37]:
So just kind of urging seeking mental health care for anyone who this might resonate with because it makes it extra hard.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:07:46]:
Yes. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:07:47]:
And I know, I think this is improving in general in our society around, like, stigma with mental health care, that there’s often this idea, like something is wrong or it’s about a diagnosis. But when I think about this sort of thing with separation anxiety, I’m like, it is normal to be having lots of feelings when you’re separated, that counseling in this sort of context is maybe just about support. I don’t know how you think about it and talk about it with people, but going through this rough life thing, that is normal. That it’s rough.

Megan McCullough [00:08:30]:
Yeah, but it’s rough. Right. And, you know, I think similar to the military is. Right. Drive on and suck it up. And oftentimes the spouses will see that in their service member, the husband or wife who’s wearing the uniform, that person is often taught very different things than what you might be learning in therapy about how to cope. And so there’s this cultural almost notion within the military, too, of sucking it up.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:09:00]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:09:02]:
And push forward and keep going.

Megan McCullough [00:09:05]:
Right. Push forward and keep going. Push forward and keep going.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:09:09]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:09:10]:
And so that’s like, sometimes, like you shared, there can be this internal stigma. Oh, my gosh, I’m going to counseling and everyone’s going through this together, so what’s wrong with me? And really, there’s nothing wrong with you at all. You’re having very normal feelings to a very abnormal situation.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:09:29]:
Yes.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:09:30]:
I love that phrase. Normal feelings. An abnormal situation.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:09:34]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:09:36]:
Right. And we think about you know, separation in the military many times, you know, our spouse isn’t somewhere safe. Right. So there’s an extra layer of fear and worry.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:09:47]:
Yes.

Megan McCullough [00:09:49]:
And oftentimes, too, if I’m jumping the gun. Excuse me, but, you know, our spouses have very different mechanisms to deal with when they have to leave. So that can cause issues with attachment as well, too, if the spouse is having a very difficult time and then the one who left is pulling away or retreating as a way to cope. So that can definitely cause ruptures as well.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:10:12]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:10:13]:
Can you maybe give some more examples or share a little bit more of what that might look like?

Megan McCullough [00:10:20]:
Yeah, absolutely. Sure. So I think I’m also a veteran myself. I spent four years on active duty, so I can speak to both sides of this. The mentality as a soldier, when you have to leave, whether it’s a tdy, it could be a deployment, it could be a school, it could be any number of reasons why you’re having to go.

You really have to get into the mentality of being mission ready, and I have to focus on my task. And in order to do that, sometimes you have to detach a little bit from your family in order to stay focused and keep the mission done. And that does not mean that you don’t love your family.

Megan McCullough [00:11:01]:
That does not mean you don’t miss them every second of the day. But for some people, kind of putting a little bit of an emotional wall up is the only way that that person can focus on their job because it’s too painful to think about people that are left behind. You kind of go into a. An ovation mode. So for any spouse that might be experiencing this, you know, my husband did this when he deployed multiple times as well, too, right?

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:11:28]:
Yes. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:11:30]:
And I’m just thinking I could see how that would cause a lot of friction or conflict. If I don’t know. That’s what you need to do to like that. That’s my service member spouse’s coping skill, that it would be to be thinking about missing us, that they. They have to go into tunnel vision mode to. To focus. If I didn’t know that, I could be taking it really personally. Like, oh, you don’t.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:12:02]:
You don’t miss me? Something like that.

Megan McCullough [00:12:05]:
And the spouse may not even know that they’re doing this. Right. This could be just an automatic. My mind turns on when I go to work, and then I turn it off.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:12:14]:
Yeah. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:12:16]:
So that’s really, I think, probably helpful for us to remember to know because they may not be able to vocalize that or say like, this is what I do to cope, or have a really direct conversation about that because it might be automatic, right.

Megan McCullough [00:12:34]:
It might just be very automatic and it could be a repeated pattern in the marriage. So this is where we get a little bit of cup counseling could be helpful, even just a few sessions. I really like Corey Weathers. She’s an LPC and she has written a number of fantastic books about being in a military marriage. She’s also a military spouse. Fantastic. I think anyone would really appreciate her work, too.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:12:58]:
Okay, great. I actually haven’t read any of her books. I’m not familiar with that name. What are some, like what’s.

Megan McCullough [00:13:06]:
Yeah. So my favorite one that she put out is called military culture shift. And it is. Absolutely. If I had done a PhD, I would have written this dissertation. It’s about the shift of culture over the last 50 years within the military and really different generational styles and what that means and how that’s manifested and affected service members and spouses via policy and changing cultures. Amazing.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:13:31]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:13:32]:
Sounds really interesting. I’m going to end up.

Megan McCullough [00:13:35]:
Yeah, absolutely. Yes. She’s, yeah. And she’s a clinician and a spouse and very, you know, active in the community. So definitely put her out there as well.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:13:45]:
Okay, great. So I’m thinking the service member might shut off. I could see spouses sometimes shutting off.

Megan McCullough [00:13:55]:
Absolutely.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:13:56]:
Going in the reverse. But I am sort of a little bit thinking about how do people navigate? How do they hope maybe when they’re feeling all of those feelings.

Megan McCullough [00:14:12]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:14:13]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:14:14]:
I don’t know if you have thoughts on that.

Megan McCullough [00:14:16]:
Sure. I think this is something that in my practice, I’ve been in practice for, well, for 15 years, working primarily with the military, with the VA. Now I’m in private practice. But this is something I’ve seen multiple times, you know, just over and over again through my career. And it causes a lot of tension in marriages. It causes a lot of friction and a lot of problems because communication is absolutely key around issues like this. It’s one of the most important things, I think, to realize and to navigate as a couple. How do we deal when we leave? And it could be really messy at first.

Megan McCullough [00:14:54]:
You might have no idea how to do this the first time your spouse leaves. And that’s okay. That’s all right. I would say for myself personally, having gone through three deployments and basically two years of living apart for schools and then five years of geo batching for my own marriage, I would say that communication is the most important thing that has saved us and really learning my emotional needs when he’s gone and vice versa. And it’s taken years to learn that.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:15:28]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:15:28]:
For anyone who might be struggling, please know that this is not something that you figure out right away. It’s so hard.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:15:36]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:15:37]:
I am appreciating how normal. You’re making it sound like this is. This is just sort of how it goes when. When it’s like military life, I guess.

Megan McCullough [00:15:51]:
I think, yeah, I’m a very realistic therapist in my practice, and I think sometimes people just need more validation of this is hard, and it’s okay that it’s hard, and let’s. Let’s talk about it together and figure out how do we deal with this. Right?

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:16:06]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:16:08]:
No, the same for myself. You know, I have to work out. It’s critical for mental health. I have to exercise. I see my own therapist. I have an amazing support group of friends that have kept me sane, and really focusing on keeping myself busy have been the biggest things that have helped me.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:16:30]:
Yes, I hear that a lot. The busyness. I also have an individual therapist that I see as well, and I like to share that because I think a lot of people, I guess, are thinking, like, I just have to cope enough and it won’t be a struggle.

Megan McCullough [00:16:48]:
Right?

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:16:49]:
Right, yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:16:50]:
Versus. No, it is. The reality is it is a struggle. It’s a struggle for everybody.

Megan McCullough [00:16:54]:
Even with all of the supports in place, it’s still a struggle. And, you know, thinking about, how does that change our. How does that change, though? We talk to ourselves about it if our framework is, of course, this is hard. This is super hard. Versus what’s wrong with me for feeling this way.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:17:10]:
Yes. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:17:12]:
I like that so much. And I’m thinking it applies to thinking about the relationship, too. I’ve had some couples who like, right around the deployment time, it gets so stressful because of all of this separation anxiety, and we’re both trying to figure out how to cope. And communication can be really messy, especially if I have a lot of messy feelings. It’s hard to learn to communicate and communicate well when I’m having all of these feelings and we’re having these kind of opposite feelings.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:17:49]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:17:50]:
And you only have a few days together right before the person’s leaving, and you want to maximize it, but then everyone’s on edge, and maybe that’s okay.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:17:59]:
Yes.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:18:00]:
And then reminding. Reminding ourselves that it’s okay, nothing’s wrong. Like, nothing’s wrong with me, but also, nothing’s necessarily wrong with the relationship that we’re not communicating our best or it feels more of a struggle between us. I’m thinking that feels like an important thing to keep in mind as well, not just for my, like, yes, for me and the struggle I’m going through, but also, this is not indicative of the quality of our relationship or whether we’re meant to be together or whether we should stay together. All of the struggles with the. With deployment are normal. They’re the reality, and we are. I guess we’re kind of like, we’re waiting.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:18:49]:
Waiting. A lot of waiting for it to end then.

Megan McCullough [00:18:53]:
And then the part that people don’t talk about enough is the reintegration part. I found that’s actually harder than the deployment.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:19:03]:
Yeah. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:19:05]:
I think for me, it was like, I really wanted to. I was like, finally. Finally I get to be with you. But my partner did not, you know, was kind of, like, so exhausted. Just wanted to sleep and watch tv and, like, be zoned out from things for a while to reset. And I so wanted to be like, well, let’s talk. Let’s do all the things. Let’s.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:19:34]:
Let’s be together, because I’ve been without you for so long.

Megan McCullough [00:19:39]:
Right.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:19:40]:
So, yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:19:43]:
And I think it’s important to remember that talking about separation anxiety is that things might take a little bit of time to settle back down. And that’s also okay because there’s sometimes a lot of uncomfortable feelings around coming back home about readjusting to what it’s like to be together again. And if both people have maybe coped in ways that weren’t the most beneficial, then it’s hard to unpack that. Right when you come back.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:20:10]:
Yes. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:20:12]:
I just had a. I just had a memory of when my husband came back from his first deployment. I was mad. I went to go pick him up. I was so excited on the way to pick him up, and then I got there and I saw him, and then I was instantly angry. And I was angry that he had left. And it took me a while to, like, to get out of that emotion, and that really threw him off, thinking that’s, like, key part of separation anxiety. Maybe that would be on the other end, the reintegration.

Megan McCullough [00:20:50]:
Absolutely. Yeah. And think about how normalizing anger. A lot of times there’s anger around this. Why is the military telling my spouse to go again? Why does this have to happen again? You just left. And remembering that, you know, loving someone who loves something so much larger can be really hard sometimes.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:21:09]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:21:09]:
The whole space for that. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:21:12]:
Yeah.

Tips for coping with separation anxiety in relationships

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:21:12]:
Do you have any, I guess, tips or things that you like to share either with your clients or with, like, when you run into military spouses, do you have anything that you like to tell them of? Like, here’s. Here’s how to navigate this, maybe.

Megan McCullough [00:21:32]:
Wow, that’s such a big question. Yeah, I wish there was, you know, just here’s the magic website that tells you how to navigate all of this.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:21:45]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:21:45]:
I think if, you know, if you’re looking for counseling, it could be really helpful to find someone who is maybe a military spouse or has had some affiliation with the military. It can be really validating to talk with the commission that you don’t have to spell out the acronyms and that understands we’re pcsing again. He’s going tdy, blah, blah, blah. And they get it. There’s a real beauty in that. So I would really encourage, you know, spouses to look for someone who might have some lived experience with what you’ve gone through. Yeah, I also, you know, I really am a big fan of what we call grounding. Grounding skills.

Megan McCullough [00:22:23]:
I work a lot with nervous system regulation and how to actually calm your system down through somatic therapy. So I found that when we, when we feel internally wound up and we can tell that we’re wound up internally, one of the best things you can do in that moment is to find a way, maybe come back to your feet, focus on the ground, what it feels like to be present and really focus on what it feels like maybe just to be in your feet just for 20 or so seconds. That does calm down the nervous system and helps to regulate things just a little bit.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:23:01]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:23:02]:
Even just you talking about it, I sort of started noticing my feet.

Megan McCullough [00:23:08]:
We don’t notice our body. Yeah. Yeah. We stay in our heads all the time and starting to notice maybe what our body’s telling us and how we can calm ourselves down, especially with attachment. A lot of stuff going on with the nervous system that if we can learn why it’s happening and how to internally self soothe it, you can find a lot of progress.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:23:29]:
Yeah. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:23:32]:
I really like that concept of self soothing because I think in this context where the reality is it is hard, no matter what you do, it’s not going to be hard. It’s not going to not be hard.

Megan McCullough [00:23:48]:
Right. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:23:50]:
Then it sort of comes down to how can I maybe try to get comfort, the self soothing, how can I take, like, I don’t know, take the edge off, make it a little more.

Megan McCullough [00:24:05]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:24:05]:
I guess I just keep going back to comfort like this needing of comfort. So doing all the hard things.

Megan McCullough [00:24:14]:
Yeah. And even for some people, looking at a picture of your spouse, when you feel really activated, just looking at that picture, allowing yourself to feel those feelings come up of love, that can even shift your nervous system a little bit too. That comfort, that safety. And think about this as well, right?

When our spouses are deployed, you know, we want to keep it together for them. You know, I remember when my husband was deployed, we were talking on Skype. I think it was Skype then. And all of a sudden in the background I hear, you know, this plane bombing everything to crap. And I think I said, do you need to leave? He was like, oh, no, it’s fine, it’s fine.

Megan McCullough [00:24:52]:
I. No, so think about, you know, our response has to be, oh, okay, all right, we can’t freak out. Right? So how do we soothe ourselves in that process?

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:25:04]:
Yeah, I guess I’m thinking about how that’s even more important if I’m going to somehow be strong for other people. Like, if I’m in that, in that scenario, I’m kind of being strong for my spouse. Like that, falling apart on the phone even if I want to. But then I think we don’t have kids trying to avoid it as long as I can, so. Yeah, but I know that so many people do.

And then there’s also that sense of like, oh, I also have to take care of our kids and help them through their emotional reactions and they would be going through separation anxiety as well. And I’m thinking how much more important it is that I somehow can self soothe or get comfort and maybe even validate myself that it is so hard in order to one, because it’s going to be good for me and it’s going to help me, but then also to help these other people that I care about.

Megan McCullough [00:26:16]:
Yeah. Yeah. For our last three years, we chose to actually geo batch. He was in DC and I was in South Carolina for a lot of different reasons, but our daughter was six and starting to really have some issues with daddy being gone, too. So, yeah, that really resonates with me as well.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:26:35]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:26:35]:
It’s hard for not just us, but. Right. Everybody else around us and we’re the one holding it together.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:26:42]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:26:43]:
And all of the emotions, like how I might feel angry or sad or anxious or just kind of like, not at ease, intense, that everybody in the house is probably feeling that too, that big emotional reactions.

Megan McCullough [00:27:04]:
Yeah, of course. Of course. And I think what you mentioned about strength, right. I have to be strong. There’s this is, I’ve encountered this with the military over and over again. It’s, well, I have to be strong, so therefore, I can’t do x, Y, and z. And for me, that’s the biggest fallacy, because being strong means you’re admitting I need some help. That does not mean you’re not strong.

Megan McCullough [00:27:26]:
In fact, that means you’re. I think, incredibly, you can say in the system that I’m in, right. In the system that wants me to be a warfighter, I still have to take care of myself, and I could be tough and also get help.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:27:43]:
Yes.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:27:43]:
I like what that goes right back to the culture. Culture conversation of, like, strong is not. When we talk about strong, maybe because we’re both therapists, we’re not thinking push through. We’re thinking take care of myself. Notice that I need a need comfort and support and resources, so that way I can keep going versus depriving myself of and trying to keep going.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:28:16]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:28:16]:
I think, you know, for all spouses listening, I know it can be a lonely life out there. If you just PCs or you don’t have any friends, one of the most important things to do is maybe just find one person that you can connect with. If that’s an old friend from high school, if that’s a family member. But we’re talking about attachment, and if your spouse isn’t there, your primary person, who else can maybe fill that need for just a little bit and to help? Who can you turn to during that time?

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:28:44]:
Yeah. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:28:46]:
I’m thinking of. I’m thinking of a quote. So I know you and I are just meeting today, but I do mostly couples counseling, um, using EFT. And so I’m thinking of, like, sue Johnson right now, who is, like, the founder of the type of therapy I do. And she would say, like, we’re all wired for connection. And if so, I like what you’re saying. It’s like, I still need. My connection needs to be fulfilled, and my spouse can’t necessarily do that while they’re deployed, and that it’s okay to get those needs met.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:29:26]:
Other places likely still in a consensual way that is aware of not just, like, infidelity, but I think that is part of why that can happen, is, like, we still need connection needs, but that can by visiting family members. Bye. I used to do, like, phone. Phone dates, like, every week, a scheduled phone date with my best friend and things like that really, really helped even.

Megan McCullough [00:30:01]:
You know, for people that find spirituality to be helpful. Church could be something that would be really great if that’s good for you. A fitness community could be fantastic, right?

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:30:11]:
Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:30:15]:
The community aspect is what seems really common across those different activities, like the activities.

Megan McCullough [00:30:23]:
And it’s changed over the time, you know. Right. Women used to stay home more, and it was a very different military, and it’s not like that anymore. So I think it’s even harder to make connections because it’s not a stay at home spouse anymore. Wife. Right. We’re thinking traditions.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:30:40]:
Yes. Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:30:41]:
Where then all the stay at home spouses get together during the day, hang out, watch the kids and chat.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:30:52]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:30:52]:
So many people are dual income households.

Megan McCullough [00:30:57]:
So even more lonely. Right. If you’re not connected. I mean, I never. I’ll speak for myself. I was never connected with any of my husband’s units for a lot of different reasons. He had a lot of weird jobs. I didn’t want to, but, um.

Megan McCullough [00:31:12]:
Yeah. Not having that connection can also be really lonely. But I. I’d always worked outside and had. Had those needs met elsewhere, but if I hadn’t, that would have been devastating.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:31:21]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:31:23]:
So I think what we’re saying is it’s okay if your connection camp isn’t met by other military spouses or in like, a military community that you can all these other sort of communities to join that could help you both with distraction but also emotional support while your spouse is gone.

Megan McCullough [00:31:46]:
Absolutely. And I love how you said kind of thinking outside the military community. It doesn’t have to be there. You know, for a lot of reasons, people may not want to utilize the military community for support, and that’s okay. So find it in any way that it looks like for you. There’s all kinds of online military spouse groups. Every installation I know has a Facebook page. We all know sometimes a lot of drama there.

Megan McCullough [00:32:07]:
We get that. But it can be a great place for resources.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:32:11]:
Yes.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:32:13]:
Well, I’m sort of just thinking like anybody who’s listening, they might get stationed in South Carolina or they might be where you are located. How could people find you and work with you if they wanted to?

Megan McCullough [00:32:30]:
Yeah, absolutely. So I am licensed in both South Carolina and Maryland. For Maryland, it would be virtual. Only. You can find me at www.meganmucullough.care. I am also on Facebook. It is Megan McCullough Counseling. You can reach me either way. Just shoot me an email and I’ll get back to you.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:32:56]:
Okay, great. I will be including links to that in the show notes. So if anybody wants to easily find you, they can just go and click from it. From listening to this podcast.

Megan McCullough [00:33:09]:
Awesome.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:33:10]:
Yeah.

Megan McCullough [00:33:10]:
Or if anyone’s moving to South Carolina, and just want some military friends or just want some support, please reach out that way as well.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:33:18]:
Okay.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:33:18]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:33:19]:
I’m glad you included that. That’s a very kind offer. Yeah, yeah, I get it.

Megan McCullough [00:33:24]:
It’s hard. I’ve been there a million times, and.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:33:26]:
Yeah, yeah. Do you have any final thoughts or words of wisdom for our listeners before we end?

Megan McCullough [00:33:35]:
Yeah, I would just say for anyone listening, you know, the military community, it’s my heart. It’s what I’ve grown up in. But it’s a really tough life, and it’s a really unique life, and not a lot of people understand your experience and what you’re going through. So I can just shout out to all of you people out there, this is hard, and you’re doing fantastic, even if you think you’re not.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:33:56]:
Yeah, thank you. I can. I can, like, feel the encouragement and validation myself.

Megan McCullough [00:34:03]:
So, yeah, it’s a crazy life. It’s. It’s a. It’s a beautiful life, but it’s a crazy life.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:34:09]:
Yeah.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:34:11]:
Well, thank you so much for being on our podcast.

Megan McCullough [00:34:14]:
Oh, thank you for having me. It’s been my pleasure.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:34:26]:
As part of this special series on attachment in relationships, I created the ARE quiz. ​ This quiz uses the brief accessibility, responsiveness, and engagement scale, which I used in my own dissertation research and I use with each couple when I start working with them in couples counseling.

This quiz helps you and your partner know how secure your relationship is, the level of distress you’re in, when you should be considering marriage counseling, and what sort of behaviors you both can work on to help promote the security of your attachment bond. Make sure to check out the show notes to download a copy of the quiz. While I am a therapist, this podcast is for educational purposes only and is not considered therapy, and it should also not be a replacement for therapy. If you think you need a professional of any kind, you should definitely of go find one. Until next time.