Treat your relationship like a business with Dr. Robin Buckley

Episode Summary of “Treat your relationship like a business with Dr. Robin Buckley”

Welcome to Episode 37 of the Communicate & Connect Podcast, your go-to resource for strengthening military relationships. Hosted by Elizabeth Polinsky, a dedicated military marriage counselor, this episode features a fascinating conversation with Dr. Robin Buckley, an esteemed couples coach with a revolutionary approach to relationship building. Titled “Treating Your Relationship Like a Business,” this episode dives deep into the innovative realm of couples coaching versus traditional marriage counseling.

In this insightful episode, Dr. Buckley explains the growing trend of treating personal relationships with the same strategic planning and proactive measures that make businesses successful. Unlike traditional therapy, which often delves into past issues, couples coaching is future-focused, emphasizing the development of a sustainable and fulfilling partnership. Dr. Buckley shares her proprietary model that utilizes business strategies, such as creating mission statements and setting key performance indicators (KPIs), to promote relationship success.

Particularly beneficial for military and veteran families, Dr. Buckley’s approach aligns well with the structured and strategic nature of military life. She offers invaluable advice for navigating common challenges such as deployments and the reintegration of service members into family life, providing detailed plans that can be adapted to any circumstance.

Make sure to check out the show notes to sign up for our FREE 10-week relationship email course. This email course is really designed for people who are maybe having trouble with communication or connection in their relationship and helping them develop some quick wins right away to start improving it.

Guest Speaker Bio – “Dr. Robin Buckley”

Dr. Robin Buckley is a visionary thinker who integrates personal development strategies into relationship dynamics. Inspired by a book recommended by a former boss, Dr. Buckley discovered a systematic approach to life which involves creating mission and vision statements, akin to a business plan complete with vision boards. Recognizing the potential of these techniques, Dr. Buckley regularly uses them to reassess and realign personal goals. This innovative approach led to the realization of the benefits these strategies could have for couples. Dr. Buckley now explores how partners can collaboratively align their goals, fostering deeper connections and shared purpose, making personal and relational exploration a joint adventure.

Check out her new released book “Marriage Inc: The Boardroom Blueprint to a Lasting Love” on amazon.

Check out her website here.

Free Relationship Pattern Assessment

Many couples assume they have a communication problem when they’re actually stuck in a relationship pattern that keeps creating the same conflict.

Take the free Relationship Pattern Assessment to discover what pattern may be keeping you stuck and learn what to focus on next.

👉 https://pages.communicateandconnect.com/relationship-quiz

Episode Transcript for “Treat your relationship like a business with Dr. Robin Buckley”

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:00:01]:
This podcast is sponsored by Communicate and Connect Counseling, where we have a team of therapists who provide individual, couples, and family therapy services, all tailored to meet the needs of military and veteran families. To learn more about our services, visit www.communicateandconnect.com.

Welcome to the Communicate and Connect podcast for Milit relationships with your host, Elizabeth Polinsky, a military marriage counselor. If this is your first time listening to the Communicate and Connect podcast, please take a second to go, rate, review, and subscribe to make sure you get all our future episodes. We also really want to know what it is you love about our podcast. And if for some reason you’re not loving it, we want to know that too, because we’re committed to providing the best quality content to help you improve your relationships.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:01:05]:
All right, welcome back to the Communicate and Connect podcast. This is episode 37 on treating your relationship like a business with Dr. Robin Buckley. I’m excited today to have Dr. Buckley here on the podcast. She is a couples coach, and this is the first coach that we’ve really had on the podcast to talk about how a coach might approach working with couples different than a marriage counselor. So, Robin, would you mind just telling us a little bit about yourself?

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:01:47]:
Absolutely, Liz. So that’s a great question to start this off, because it is a consistent one that I get in terms of what is the difference between going to couples therapy and going to a. To couples coaching. And to start off, not a lot of people do couples coaching.

It’s a newer model. It’s one that the framework I use certainly is one that I came up with. But to delineate the difference, couples therapy is going to look at clinical issues. So when a couple needs to do a deep dive into the past and things from the past that are influencing the relationship, certainly if there’s any current or recent infidelity, addiction, abuse, or loss, that should be a couple’s therapy, because those are.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:02:30]:
Those are issues that are impacting a couple at a really can be impacting a couple at a very dysfunctional level. That’s true therapy. Couples coaching, very similar to any model of coaching, is talking about a preventative and proactive approach to creating a relationship a couple wants.

So I start off very quickly with my couple saying, we’re not going to talk about the past because we can’t change the past. And if there aren’t any of those clinical issues, there’s no reason to talk about the past. What we can talk about is where you are now, what is working so we can build on those strengths to support what’s not working, and then even more importantly, creating a plan for the future. So that’s, that’s how I would in general differentiate between the two.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:03:14]:
I’m glad that you’re talking about that because I recently. I recently had a couple that was referred to me as. I’m a marriage counselor. I just didn’t really tell you that beforehand, but I’m sure you probably knew.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:03:27]:
I looked you up and.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:03:28]:
Yeah, um, and I recently had a couple that had worked with a coach and the coach sent them to couples counseling because there was more stuff in the past. So that was. That was actually my first time getting a referral from a coach. And it was. I had really never had any of my previous clients work with a coach before. So it’s just interesting.

Choosing Qualified Coaching Professionals

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:03:51]:
I appreciate the coach did that because as you and I both know, you know, my background is meant, you know, traditional mental health and clinical psychology. And I was really hesitant for a long time to even call myself a coach, even though I went through a certified coaching program before it was really even in the industry back in 2005. But there are so many people out there that call themselves coaches and have no ability to understand the brain behavior connection and truly be able to see when there is a clinical issue.

And that should be a referral to a qualified therapist. And that’s what scares me about coaching. And when I talk with people, whether they work with me or not, I at least work to educate them of what to look for, not only in therapy, but in coaching. And make sure you get someone who is trained and has a background to do what they say they’re going to do.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:04:44]:
Yeah. And so you. I’m imagining you might also be unique in the, in the realm of coaching because you have a PhD in psychology, am I correct? It was clinical psychology too. Right. So you have a lot of the knowledge and the background around mental health to be able to differentiate.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:05:03]:
Right.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:05:04]:
What. I guess when, when somebody needs something that’s more therapy related. But I’m imagining there are other coaches who don’t necessarily have that sort of experience.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:05:14]:
No, there’s not. Unfortunately not. I do know some. I know some who have graduate degrees, whether masters or doctorates, and they’re doing coaching and some of them haven’t been trained specifically as a coach, which I’m a little uncomfortable with, but not much because at least they have the background and again, the brain behavior, emotion connection and can.

Can again identify when there’s a clinical issue and it needs a referral, whether it’s a couple in general to couples therapy or one member of the couple or both who need individual therapy. So at least people who have that training and that background within psychology and mental health, I do think they have enough, absolutely enough education and skills to function as a coach. It’s the people that have never had, you know, they. I’m hoping with the goodness of their heart, wants to help people, but they’re like, oh, I did this.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:06:03]:
I went through this, so now I’m going to teach people. And I’m like, no, no, I wouldn’t bring my car to a mechanic just because they own a car, but had never been trained as a mechanic. And I certainly wouldn’t go to a doctor who’s like, well, I have a body, so I know what to do. And yet people approach coaching very much that way.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:06:20]:
Yeah. Okay. I. I didn’t have this fully in mind when. When I was thinking about today’s episode, and I know there’s a lot we want to get into on, like, how you end up working with couples. Somebody know if it’s like a good coach to go to, like, how would someone decide that?

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:06:41]:
Right. I, first and foremost, I would ask what their background is either in their undergraduate or. Or graduate program and if they’ve gone through a certified coaching program. And then if it was me or someone I love, I would go research what that program is. Because there’s a lot of, like, organizations that say they are coaching, train, you know, training coaches, but they’re. It’s very loose. So I would find one that has. It is at least supported by the icf, the International Community Coaching Federation.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:07:13]:
So it doesn’t have to be that they have the actual initials. I don’t think it’s necessary to go the full way. I mean, I think that’s great for some people, but at least something that’s. That’s recognized by the one governing body, body of the coaching industry. And if they say, yes, I went through, you know, my background is psych. What does that mean? Does it mean you just have your bachelor’s, which really isn’t going to do much for new. But if you have your master’s degree or your doctorate degree in some area of psychology or mental health, then I think that’s a secure place to start. So either absolutely.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:07:48]:
Has gone through a certified coaching program and. Or has a background in mental health or psychology. Those are the coaches that I admire and think that they really do great work.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:07:59]:
Yeah. And who you would trust. Absolutely. Okay, great. Well, thank you for explaining that. So can you tell us A little bit about what brought you to coaching and couples coaching, too, because I have seen. I think when I have heard of coaching in the past, it’s usually been like business coaches. So how did you come into couples coaching?

Proactive Life and Couples Coaching

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:08:26]:
So what I always loved about helping individuals was those individuals who were coming in before there was a cris. And as you know, in your work, a lot of times we do see a lot of those crisis interventions. And. But the individuals or couples that were like, you know, we’re just in a rut, or we’re just not functioning the way we want to function, those are the ones that they’re motivated, they’re not disillusioned already, and they are ready to make a change.

So I didn’t initially start out doing couples coaching because it’s, like I said earlier, it’s not really a thing. In fact, when people find they’re like, what does that mean? Couples coaching? And so I was doing work as an executive coach with a lot of female executives. So C suite power women. And when I would talk to them very often, because I do think many women don’t have that clear delineation between work and personal life.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:09:19]:
Like, everything we do tends to enmesh and affect each other. So as we were talking about their careers and their professional plans, sometimes they would also talk about their family or their significant others. And what I found over time, Liz, was that these women who could go into a boardroom and manage a negotiation or go into a courtroom and deal with conflict, they didn’t translate their skills and their strengths to their home life.

So I’d say, when they bring up their relationships, well, how do you manage conflict with your husband or your spouse? And they’d be like, I don’t know. We just don’t. We can’t communicate. We can’t do this. So I would flip them and say, okay, tell me how you do it at work.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:09:58]:
Like, how do you manage conflict on your team? How do you communicate with your peers? And these women could recite their strengths, their skills, how they do it, how they manage it, and then I bring them back again, okay, so can you do that in your relationship? And they would shut down and they’d be like, no, that’s different. And why? Why is it different? It’s a relay. It’s an interaction. It’s a relationship. So I would work with them to start to see that there doesn’t have to be that differentiation. You can still use those skills, maybe in. With a slightly more personal way or. But they can be applied.

Couples Coaching Using Business Strategies

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:10:33]:
So As I did this work, very often they would start saying things like, could we do like a couples coaching? Is that a thing? And I had to wrap my brain, I’m like, I don’t know, is that a thing? Like, why couldn’t I do that? I used to do couples therapy, so why couldn’t I address it from the baseline of knowing how to manage interpersonal relationships in a setting, in a session, but from the coaching side. And so I started doing that.

I make sure that whatever individual work I did with a woman was done because I did retain that from my background. Like I’m not. Those are not going to be blurry. And then getting consent from the significant other partner that it was okay. Even though I had previously worked with typically the female in the relationship. And I started doing this work where we looked at their relationship like a business and we applied all business principles around getting them to the level that they were satisfied and happy again.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:11:31]:
I see what you mean about sort of the strengths based and the. For the sort of forward looking. Because even as you describe that, if it just feels very different than what I do like with the couples who come in. And that’s is really so interesting and fascinating that it was. I have this huge skill set at work. Like I’m super successful, a total badass. And then I can’t figure out, right, I’m stuck with how do I use the same skills in my relationship. So.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:12:03]:
And you said you created your own model for this. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:12:10]:
Yeah, and I, I’m still at the place of. I always feel myself hesitating when I want to call it a proprietary model. But my business coach said, robin, have you found anybody else doing this? And I’m like, no. And I’ve looked. So this model is that. And as you know, Liz, like couples therapy can be very emotional and very painful. And a lot of times in our industries, emotions cloud strategic thinking because we’re reacting and we’re not able to really get to that cognitive level of clarity sometimes in the middle of an emotional reaction. Understandably so.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:12:48]:
With the coaching model, I worked and I used my background doing cognitive behavioral therapy to help people separate out the emotions from their thinking. And the way I do it is by reducing the emotionality simply at the very basic level in. In terms of words. So for example, we don’t talk about problems or challenges in a relationship. We talk about pain points. And pain points is a specific business terminology that is just talking about what’s challenging the company from achieving a Goal. So a pain point in a relationship is what’s challenging the relationship from being what you want it to be. So that’s one, you know, step back.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:13:26]:
We talk about collaterals instead of children or, you know, parents that, you know, anyone that you’re doing the caretaking for, because I don’t know about you, but when we, I talk about my children, there is an emotional like, visceral reaction. Even if it’s a good one, it’s still visceral. But when we talk about collaterals, it just separates you a little bit more. So even from the basic words we use, it starts to develop the atmosphere and the culture. That emotion right now doesn’t have a place. Emotion has a place in your relationship.

But right now we’re talking about the business strategy of your relationship. And in those strategy sessions, we try and keep it as objective as possible because again, in a business negotiation or a business meeting, you don’t get emotional because then you can’t really tap into your professional skills that’s going to make that again meeting or negotiation successful.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:14:21]:
So it starts from the basic level of words and the whole framework is around a business plan for your relationship. So couples get. We. I use a Google Doc that couples get refreshed after every session. So they actually have a black and white business plan where they can look at the goals, the goals they’ve established, the KPIs that they’ve established.

To analyze their goals, I typically recommend particularly when I start with a couple weekly review sessions where they sit down with an agenda and go over whatever the things are that are coming up in the next week, or we build in quarterly or they’re not annual, they’re quarterly reviews. Because in business where it’s, it’s absolute that you get an annual review to see how you’re doing. But so few couples do that in their relationship.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:15:10]:
They just are like, yeah, it feels better. And I’m like, in business, we would never say it feels better. We want like data around that. So that’s, that’s kind of the overview of how I do it.

Collaborative Goal Setting for Couples

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:15:20]:
Okay, that is, that is just really cool. I, I’m just taking it in a little bit. I, I had read a book a long time ago called the On Purpose Person. It was like recommended to me by an old boss, but it kind of described this similar process for just for you. It wasn’t a couple thing. It was like how to think about your life and kind of create like a mission statement and a vision statement and go about sort of like a business plan thing with a vision board and stuff, but it sounds almost similar.

And I actually end up doing that like every, every couple years as like a reset on where, where do I want to head? And I have for a long time thought like, oh, that would be kind of cool to do with my partner and see, like, you know, are there ways that our goals are aligned or how do we want to think about our goals collaboratively? So that sounds like. That sounds like a lot of fun actually to do.

Couples Coaching Success: Strategic Relationship Boost

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:16:29]:
I love the couples that every time I get a new clients coming in or repeat clients, because sometimes, you know, they’re good, they’re on their own, as, you know, got them out the door, and then something will happen. Usually it’s when there’s some transition, you know, they just had a baby or all the kids are gone or a new job, and then they’ll come back in for booster sessions and, you know, we do two or three sessions. They create an addendum to their business plan and then they’re up and running.

And I just, I get so excited to work with individuals so that they have these really strategic plans. And I love the ones that come in saying, we chose you because we’ve tried couples therapy and it didn’t work for us. And you and I both know therapy doesn’t work because it wasn’t the right match or the right therapeutic approach. But a lot of people, they just shut down. They’re like, nope, therapy is not for me.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:17:17]:
And for those people or when they’re in a couple and one member of the partnership is really hesitant, this gives them an alternative. And I, I always like giving people options.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:17:27]:
Yes. Yeah, yeah, that, that’s cool. And I, I also like that there are these regular reviews that take place.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:17:37]:
And I love just taking earlier, about that book, the, the purposeful or the on purpose person, you mentioned a mission statement, and it made me crack up because that’s actually the very first thing I do with all couples is we talk about really, do you have mission statements at work? And of course they can tell me they do. And, and the why, you know, gives a focus and keeps people unified.

And then my, my, you know, stinger question is, do you have so what’s your relationship mission statement? And I have yet to have a couple say, well, here it is. They look at me and they’re like, you know, usually it’s, we don’t have one. And I’ll say, but why? Because your company thinks it’s important enough and you see the value. Why don’t you have it in your relationship. And they’re like, I don’t know. Why don’t we have one in our relationship? And so they get to create one.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:18:22]:
And all the benefits of a professional mission statement apply to their relationship, and it becomes such a dynamic tool to evaluate what they’re doing and decisions they’re making individually or collectively. And I love watching that.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:18:37]:
I can just see how this would have such a big impact on so many areas. Like, from, like, oftentimes I hear couples tell me, like, well, we’re not on the same page. They don’t. And they don’t feel on the same page. I know I’m bringing up feelings. I’m in the. I’m in the world of emotion. So.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:18:56]:
But they don’t feel on the same page. And that is a way to. To get on the same page is to have that business plan. And I was thinking you had mentioned decision making and, you know, money. I’m thinking about money. Money is one of the top conflicts that couples often have. Wow, what a way to be able to make decisions about money. If we have a plan that we’ve come up with together that we’re saying these are the priorities, this is where we’re headed, it makes the decision decisions around money or choices like that so much easier.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:19:37]:
Yep, I’ve. I’ve had. I’ve addressed that specific topic again a lot with couples, as you noted, it’s. It’s often a pain point. And for some. Some of my couples, I remember, they created a protocol of how they make a financial decision. Some couples actually create a visual flowchart because that’s what works for them in their professional lives. They have a flowchart that they will build into their plan so it’s always accessible to both members.

“Creating Your Financial Decision Avatar”

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:20:03]:
And then some of the last strategy is they create. In business, it’s called an ideal client avatar or customer avatar, where you know who you’re targeting. Well, in this case, I take out the C, and I’m like, you’re creating an ideal avatar of what it looks like in terms of your finances. And then every decision comes back to, does it fit the avatar? So it depends on, again, what the couple can gravitate to. But I love that when they talk about money issues, I’m like, all right, tell me how you do make these kind of financial decisions at work, in your business or in your company.

What does it look like? How do you budget at work? And as soon as they can articulate, well, we do it this way or this way, I’m like, okay, could you do it that way in your relationship? And then those three examples, typically it’s one of those three since they’re typically used in business. So.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:20:51]:
Yeah. Yeah. Very, very cool. I could see the benefits that that would have for couples, like not only in just being on the same page, but in the prevention of problems or conflict. And I was thinking it makes sense how that is different than marriage counseling because it is so forward focused. But I also have to have enough. I guess I’m thinking like emotional regulation. Like I have to be able to put, put emotions on pause a little bit to have conversations like that.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:21:32]:
And I think, you know, you were talking about those crisis, like crisis moments that couples come in with. And when I’m in a crisis, I don’t have the ability to pause my emotions. I’m, I’m. My emotions are sort very raw, very sensitive and coming out. And that’s where that would be. I would see that being hard. It would be hard then to have a conversation like that when the emotions are so strong.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:22:05]:
I mean, I’ve dealt with couples who are frustrated with each other, and sometimes it looks like anger and, and that’s where, you know, I tend to, like, pull them back into their, you know, so at work, when you’re frustrated with someone, do you let the anger come out or how do you regulate it? And they. Again, I have seen.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:22:21]:
Oh, yeah.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:22:22]:
And. And male and female clients, as soon as I get them to shift their thinking to their professional lives, the emotion drops away, whether it was because they were crying or about to get angry. But you get their brain to shift and all of a sudden they’re, they’re back in that professional mode and now they can talk about it. And then I get them to reapply it. So it’s it. You’re right. I, I love that I have the education to be able to know when a couple is not ready for coaching.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:22:49]:
Yeah.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:22:50]:
And they need the referral. And I’ve had couples where they’ve come in and sometimes an infidelity comes out in the first couple sessions that either wasn’t revealed to me or wasn’t revealed in the relationship. And that’s where everything stops, because that has to come first. But for couples who are in a rut, just not as happy or satisfied or. Some of my couples are also starting a commitment and they don’t want to make mistakes that they made in the past. So they want a better plan because they didn’t have a plan in the past.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:23:15]:
Oh, my gosh.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:23:16]:
I love that.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:23:17]:
I wish Every, I wish every couple would go through your program as, like, as their premarital thing. Yes. I’m a, I’m a big fan of premarital counseling.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:23:31]:
Absolutely.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:23:31]:
To, to do this sort of thing, to get in sync from the beginning on all these different factors that go into sharing your life with somebody.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:23:42]:
Absolutely. It’s funny, isn’t it? Because when we think about how much time and money we spend, most couples spend planning a wedding. You know, for a five to six hour event in America, it’s about 250 hours that they plan and they spend $25,000. And then I’ll ask a couple, well, how much time and money did you put into planning the marriage, the decades long marriage? And again, there might be like, well, we’ve had some con, you know, we know we want kids eventually. I’m like, those are wishes. And get a business. We would never create a business around a wish and a hope. We have a plan.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:24:18]:
And yet so much time is spent on the ceremony and not the actual commitment. And yeah, it’s sadly funny to me.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:24:26]:
But yes, I, I can really relate to that feeling and understand that. Yeah. So I’m thinking about the, the people who are listening to this podcast are military couples predominantly. And you know, I’m thinking like, the service members are probably really going to jive with everything that you’re saying. It’s going to fit very well with how military life functions. We have this strategic plan. We’re all on the same page. Let’s go implement it, let’s come back and debrief.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:25:02]:
Like, when I hear my husband talk about his work, I’m like, this is going to be the, this is going to be something he’d love. Yeah. And, and I. So I’m thinking about that. And I’m also thinking about, like, things that they might, they might say, like how.

How would we do this with a deployment? Or how would we do this when there are big chunks of time that I’m not going to see my partner. I don’t know if you have any thoughts or tips for how military couples might try to navigate something like this when they have. Yeah, when they have deployments or they have very unpredictable schedules or sort of that type of thing.

Military Family Deployment Strategy

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:25:49]:
I’ve worked with a couple more than a couple of military families and it isn’t that different because it comes down to the planning. So if they’re lucky enough to have advance notice of a deployment, then certainly utilizing that time to create the plan, the plan of what the communication is going to look like. What’s the plan B? When communication isn’t as easy due to whatever circumstances like how do we ensure that there is a plan, a backup plan and then a secondary backup plan which again as you noted, those, the military family members and actual active service people, they jive with it because that’s how they function.

So it’s like we’re talking the same language. If there isn’t that advanced luxury, then it’s making sure that there’s always the bug out bag basically. But this is their bug out plan. Like okay, if I have to go in two hours notice, we don’t have time to sit down and make a plan. And so what is the plan that we’re just going to pull out of the drawer and that’s going to be the act of plan at the moment because we don’t have time to do in moment planning.

Military Family Reintegration Strategies

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:26:58]:
And again I, I see that it, my experience has been that it creates a level of, of comfort and, and security knowing okay, we either have a, a plan if there’s no time and we have a plan when there is time and we can borrow from each. But a lot of it is around communication and, and then I do love that in regards specific to the military families, then they also have a plan for when they come back when they are. Yes, because that’s important and it’s important for both members.

It’s important for the one that was back at home taking care of everything, not just assuming that the other person is going to be able to just dive right in and pick up where they left off, that they might have to be retrained, that things might have changed, especially for longer deployments. And it’s for the other person per the active military who comes back to know, okay, yeah, we can work with a three week, you know, re entry process and easing you back in. And what are the things that as of right now you think will be important to support you as you come back in.

And gosh, if it involved any kind of fighting situation, I forget the actual military term but then that’s even more important. So it’s having that plan already in place so that it’s not something that has to be done when they come back.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:28:17]:
It’s just there and it’s just going to be instituted as soon as they step off that plane and have the first phone call home. And I really, I love the reassure any. Anytime I can support, anytime I can support people that do so much to support all of us. Oh my goodness, that’s where, that’s where I’m like, that’s, that’s an honor. That’s not even my job. So.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:28:41]:
Yeah, yeah, I can understand that. I can hear the, I’m so emotionally based. I can like hear it in your voice right now even as you’re talking.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:28:49]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Military and first responders. I just, I, I, I don’t know how old I have to get to be able to, you know, say that they go the places none of us would dream of going or wanting to go. Like, I just can’t, even with all my training and experience, I cannot quite get to that level of how do you do that? And if I can help them because of what I know how to do, then again, it is, it is just truly an honor at that point. So.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:29:18]:
Yeah, I appreciate you sharing that. Yeah, I loved the idea of a coming home plan too, because I’m thinking like, if you don’t have that plan, then we’re really not on the same page. Like I can even think when my, when my husband came back from the first time he was gone, he came back and I was mad at him. I was like, how, Like, I was so excited up until the point that I saw him and then I saw him and I was just mad that he had ever left. And of course I got over that kind of quickly, but it threw us both off.

And then I would want to do things and he would just want to relax and so not having a clear idea of like, how are we going to get re back on the same page together? What do you need to transition? I can see that being really valuable because I’ve also heard other military couples talk about that too. That sort of tension, tension that comes with, we have different longings, different, different desires in that initial phase of getting re situated together.

Military Couple Debriefing Strategy

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:30:41]:
For a lot of couples, military couples specifically, a debrief is really an important part of their business plan for when, when the they’re rejoined and the debrief typically, I typically recommend know that they wait at least two weeks to give get to implement the plan, give those two weeks and then debrief anywhere two to two to four weeks. I don’t like it, I don’t recommend it go longer than four weeks.

But to say, okay, what’s, what’s been working, what is not working, what, what plans and protocols can we put around the things that aren’t working? So it’s not just that we’re just assuming again, feel like things are good or oh, feel things don’t feel good or like they are good. It’s what are our KPIs around evaluating? Are things really good? Are we, are we imagining it? Are we hoping for it? Or is do we actually have data that things are going according to the plan?

And if there’s anything that’s not now, it gives the couple an opportunity to create a new addendum to the plan instead of just trying to make a plan that’s not working work like so many of us do, that as humans, as you know, we have a plan, we have a routine, but if it’s not working, then let’s adjust. So I think the debrief is a really important step that if the couple doesn’t think of it on their own than I suggest it because I don’t think just to keep going without some check in is valuable.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:32:06]:
Yeah, sort of like sometimes plans change. Like you make your best plan, but then what if some things come up? Life happens. You don’t want to keep doing the same thing when, when it might need to be modified.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:32:23]:
And what changed at home during, you know, whether it’s a month deployment, whether it’s a two year deployment, what changed at home that now that original plan, it doesn’t apply anymore. Or what changed for that active military while they were gone that, that now they need some, or want some different things. That’s what the debrief does, is just not assuming, hey, we said this, so it must be what we’re doing. It gives them a chance to actually have a scheduled talk.

And I actually, when there is time to plan before a deployment, I, I encourage the couple to put it on the calendar. If they have a general, of course, you know, military a little bit flexible, but if they have a general idea or as the deployment is coming to an end, they have a more secure idea. Get the, get the debriefing on the calendar before they’re even home so that you know, and if it has to adjust, it adjusts. But it’s there because if it’s on the calendar, it happens.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:33:14]:
You and I both know if it’s not on the calendar, doesn’t happen.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:33:17]:
Yeah, very even. That is business. Like put it, schedule it exactly. It’s on the calendar, I’ll show up. Yeah.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:33:25]:
Yep. I, I cannot tell you. I could tell you the conversations I have with couples. I again, I bring them back to you. I’m like, on your work calendar, what’s on your work calendar? And you know, they’ll list it off. I’m like, so everything you want to make sure happens because you know, to make some level of success for whatever the overall goal is. Yes. Okay.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:33:43]:
What’s on your personal calendar? And I, I truly believe as a couples coach, everything should be on the, on, on a couple shared private calendar, and that includes physical connection time. So I’ve worked with couples where I’m like, if they’re dissatisfied with their sex life, put it on your calendar. And they’re, of course, people put like, no, Robin, it shouldn’t be like that.

It should be spontaneous. And in the moment, I’m like, great. How’s that working for you? It’s not working. And put it on the calendar until it becomes just a part. Part of your regular existence or maybe it never does and you just leave it on the calendar and then you know it’ll happen.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:34:19]:
And that’s wonderful.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:34:21]:
It’s, it’s, it’s kind of letting go of the fairy tale. In order to switch to the business model like we want to. We want a healthy business. We want a healthy, thriving business. I’m going to use that sort of like, business model. But it’s so different than the fairy tale of where or like the romance movie where things just happen naturally and we have all of this gushing positive emotions all the time.

“Business Plan Foundations for Lasting Marriage”

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:34:47]:
And the way I usually phrase it, Liz, is, and I’ve used fairy tale for, is that you create the business plan so you can have the fairy tale. You know, you create the foundation so that all the bells and whistles of emotion and sexual connection and love, they just get enhanced.

But if your hope, hoping and praying that the marriage will be secure enough with no plan that love and sexual attraction are going to maintain, just look at the divorce rates. And yeah, you know, that, that, that the societal expectation of that you have a commitment and it’s just going to stay that way because you said the words again. In business, we would never rely on just words. We would have a plan.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:35:28]:
I’m just thinking about the time, so I, I’m really so glad that you were on this podcast. Do you have any last thoughts or final words of advice for military couples?

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:35:40]:
Yeah, for every couple and especially the military. I. If you do nothing else, if you take away nothing else from this podcast, just create a mission statement with your, your partner. It. Not only is it a lovely date to talk about where you want to get to in the future and how you’re going to do that to together, but it truly can become a tool that for every decision and every behavior, you can use it as an evaluating tool to say, does this support the mission?

Does this support where we’re going to. So if nothing else, that’s what I recommend for all couples. But I think military can really, really gravitate to that.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:36:16]:
Well, yeah, I like that. I like that. Well, you know, I think I would be super supportive of people working with coaches. You know, I haven’t, I’ve not come across couples coaches before. You’re the first one. But you’re, you gave us like the framework of how do we know who to look for, who, who to trust, who might be able to help us with our marriage, how to think about who is a marriage counselor. Like when a marriage counselor could help versus a coach could help. So could you tell people, like how they could work with you if they wanted to?

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:36:53]:
Absolutely. And whether it’s working with me or asking questions, I’m always happy to be a resource. So My website is Dr. Robin Buckley, all one word, no periods, abbreviated doctor. And I’m also on a lot of social media so you can find me on Instagram, LinkedIn, Twitter. We’ll see how long Twitter’s around. And then my wonderful older teenage kids convinced me to go on Tik Tok. But they very clearly are not happy with my choice because my, as they say, my, your videos are boring.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:37:22]:
Mom, you’re just talking. I’m like, right, I’m there to help people not dance. So.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:37:29]:
I have not tried TikTok it.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:37:33]:
I’m coming to it. But it actually started because of my TED Talk and that got on Tick tock.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:37:38]:
So.

Dr. Robin Buckley [00:37:38]:
Or at least segments of it. So I was like, all right, I’m already there. I might as well just keep going. So.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:37:43]:
Okay, cool. Well, I will. I’ll include links to your website in the show notes so that way it’s easy for people to find. But yeah. Thank you so much for being on the podcast, Liz. Thank you so much. This is a pleasure.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky [00:38:05]:
I hope you enjoyed today’s episode. If so Please take a second to go rate, review and subscribe so you get all of our future episodes. Make sure to check out the show notes to sign up for our FREE 10-week relationship email course.

This email course is really designed for people who are maybe having trouble with communication or connection in their relationship and helping them develop some quick wins right away to start improving it. While I am a therapist, this podcast is for educational purposes only and is not considered therapy and it should also not be a replacement for therapy. If you think you need a professional of any kind, you should definitely go find one. Until next time.